Microsoft's Hyper-V is released. Come join us for a discussion around management topics with Hyper-V. In this first chat we will discuss general managment with Hyper-V. In the upcoming weeks we will focus on using Microsoft's System Center Virtual Machine Manager and OpenManage on Hyper-V.

Technical Community - Background Reading

TechCenter Hyper-V Systems Management landing page
Microsoft Hyper-V Website
Microsoft SVCMM Website

Chat Transcript

DELL-ScottH	hey Krenms !
Krenms	Hey there
DELL-ScottH	are you with dell, or customer, or partner, or alien life form ?
Krenms	I am a customer
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DELL-ScottH	waiting on Todd to join then we'll kick it off ... give a few more minutes for connections
DELL-ScottH	there he is ... hey todd
DELL-ToddM	Hello All!
DELL-ScottH	ohh we started tweeting
DELL-ScottH	you guys into that ?
DELL-ScottH	www.twitter.com/delltechcenter
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DELL-ToddM	I think that he clicked, instead of right click
rayg	sorry, rookie here>
Krenms	woops
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DELL-ScottH	ohh yeah
DELL-ScottH	hello simplygq
DELL-ScottH	nice nick
DELL-ToddM	Forgot to warn you to right click on links to avoid leaving chat
DELL-ToddM	Hey gq
simplygq	hey
DELL-ScottH	I'd like to welcome everybody to this week's chat session
DELL-ScottH	we'll be discussion Hyper-v management for the next few weeks
DELL-ScottH	I'll be honest, we just started diving into Scvmm 2008, so if anybody else want to chime in with experiences ... feel free
Krenms	I've tried it a bit
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DELL-ScottH	We've got Greg Ramsey with us ... he's a Ms Mvp on System Center products .. so I'm sure he'll mouth off about things
DELL-ScottH	:-)
DELL-ToddM	Welcome Krauseed - We are just getting started
ramseyg_dell	:)
DELL-ScottH	how long have you tried it ?
DELL-ToddM	Action, Recent room history will catch you up on the chat so far
DELL-ScottH	I started a page to gather our findings from using it in the lab .....
DELL-ScottH	Reminder ... right click, or you'll get caught in our trap :-)
Krenms	I tried it a couple weeks in beta form....pissed me off so I stopped trying. I'm thinking about trying it out again now that is Rc
DELL-ScottH	http://www.delltechcenter.com/page/hyper-v+management
DELL-ScottH	what was it doing that got under your skin ?
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DELL-ToddM	Quick Tip - If you right click on links it won't cause you to exit the hat
DELL-ScottH	I've got some screen shots from our use in the lab -- http://www.delltechcenter.com/page/scvmm+-+system+center+virtual+machine+manager
DELL-ToddM	chat
rayg	I was reading the docs about it today... sounds really cool and powerfull. What sucks with it?
DELL-ScottH	Todd installed it ... any issues you had with install todd ?
DELL-ScottH	I think the main thing was that the server portion only installs on W2k08 x64
DELL-ToddM	Install is actually not too bad - Only one thing that I thought was kinda strange
DELL-ToddM	You have to install the server portion, then the admin console as two seperate processes
DELL-ToddM	Usually Microsoft will have a single installer that will give you options for all the pieces
DELL-ToddM	Like with Exchange or Sql Server
rayg	Is it still true that it only installs on 08x64?
Krenms	Yes..only x64
rayg	hmm
DELL-ScottH	but the console can install on w2k03
DELL-ToddM	The server portion also must be installed on W2k8
DELL-ScottH	it has a client piece
DELL-ScottH	didn't you install that client piece on W2k3 todd ?
DELL-ToddM	Yes - I have the admin console "client piece" on a W2k3 server
DELL-ToddM	This is the same way that Vmware has done their Virtual Center management software
DELL-ToddM	There is a server and client piece
DELL-ScottH	One of the first things we did was to integrate our Vmware Virtual Center server into the console ...
DELL-ToddM	That can be installed on the same system or on seperate systems
Krenms	I get that.........do you need two servers for Hyper-v to work well?
DELL-ScottH	I was quite suprised at the level of managability
DELL-ToddM	I don't think that you need two servers for Hyper-v to work well - but I would recommend that you put the Scvmm on a seperate server from Hyper-v
DELL-ToddM	Maybe I'm splitting hairs - but I see Hyper-v and Scvmm seperately
DELL-ScottH	that was the one little thing that got under my skin ... I've built a nice server under W2k03 with all my managment software , Scom Sccm, Ita, Altiris .... and I couldn't install Scvmm 08 on that
DELL-ToddM	Now that I think about it, this probably isn't fair becuase I assume that Virtual Center is used with Esx Server.....
rayg	do you guys have any links to scvmm and its reqs?
DELL-ScottH	Scvmm 08 Faq -- http://download.microsoft.com/download/7/1/2/712b16f6-8c74-47df-9fa9-9c417d4620fc/scvmm08+faqv2_final.pdf
DELL-ToddM	Scvmm 08 is still only a Release Candidate
rayg	linky no good :(
DELL-ScottH	http://download.microsoft.com/download/7/1/2/712b16f6-8c74-47df-9fa9-9c417d4620fc/scvmm08%20faqv2_final.pdf
DELL-ScottH	that one work >
DELL-ScottH	?
rayg	yep!
DELL-ScottH	and here's the general overview whitepaper -- http://download.microsoft.com/download/6/f/8/6f8a7125-041a-46f9-a9ec-362b13fe0445/vmm2008_white_paper_draft3.6_final.pdf
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rayg	ok so can you use scvmm 2005 to manage win2k8 Vm hosts and clients?
DELL-ToddM	You can get to the download of Scvmm 08 in it's current form here - http://www.microsoft.com/systemcenter/virtualmachinemanager/en/us/future-version.aspx
DELL-ScottH	I have to say the Virtual Center integration is slick .... I did Vmotion out of the box, and worked fine ... I'm going to do a demo on it and should have out by end of this week ..... I'm recording voice on it right now
DELL-ScottH	no not svcmm 05
DELL-ScottH	Scvmm 05 won't manage hyper-v
rayg	hmmm ok
rayg	so does hyper v come with management tools built in that are ok? Or is scvmm08 a must?
DELL-ScottH	but scvmm 08 will manage virtual server
DELL-ScottH	Todd can speak to that
DELL-ScottH	what did you find out of the box with hyper-v
DELL-ScottH	?
DELL-ToddM	Scvmm 07 will only manage Microsoft Virtual Server - Not Hyper-v
DELL-ToddM	Additionally - You need to get the patch for Scvmm 08 for it to be able to manage the released final version of Hyper-v
DELL-ToddM	Scvmm 08 beta without the patch will only manage Hyper-v Rc-1
rayg	how beefy of a box is needed for scvmm08 - say to manage 10 - 20 host machines maybe 40 vm's?
DELL-ToddM	The Scvmm 08 beta patch - is on the download site for it
ramseyg_dell	fyi - some background on scvmm08 and hyper-v - http://blogs.technet.com/rakeshm/archive/2007/12/18/scvmm-and-the-hyper-v-beta.aspx
DELL-ScottH	machine with 2.8 2GB of ram can manage 100's of hosts and thousands of Vm's
DELL-ScottH	that's what the Faq says ... so probably double it :-)
rayg	schweet... I guess I just need x64!
DELL-ScottH	we've got it on a Pe 2970 with few Gbs of Ram
DELL-ToddM	You will need to use a Sql Server Db backend to support Scvmm if you are going to use it for more than test or a few hosts
rayg	I thought that I read that it would install Sql Express ?
rayg	20 vms?
DELL-ToddM	During install it gives you the option to install Sql Server Express - Sql Msde - or point to a Sql instalnce
DELL-ToddM	20 vms would probably be fine on Sql Express
DELL-ToddM	How many Vms do you think you will have in six months?
DELL-ToddM	a year?
rayg	probably 6, then 12
Krenms	I plan on using it for our test enviorment
rayg	Production here!
DELL-ToddM	For test - Sql Express if fine
DELL-ToddM	For a small production env - you are probably also fine
DELL-ScottH	Krenms, what is the test environment ?
Krenms	Xp most likely with steady state
DELL-ToddM	I haven't read the docs closely for Scvmm and the Db - but with Vmware and Virtual Center I believe that they only support full blown Sql or Oracle
DELL-ToddM	Leaving Sql Express as a test and dev type thing
DELL-ToddM	Microsoft could be completely different in their requirements
Krenms	I am also trying out Vmware Server 2.0 Atm
rayg	roger.
DELL-ScottH	interseting .... is this your first stab at virtualization ? .. would be interesting to hear your thoughts on Vmware vs Ms
rayg	it will be mine.
Krenms	I've used vm's before........first time setting up a test enviroment though
DELL-ScottH	the self-service portal in Scvmm08 is pretty cool
Krenms	We've got a huge box to host our test enviroment
DELL-ScottH	you play with that ?
Krenms	haven't tried it yet
DELL-ScottH	define huge ...
Krenms	8 proc 32gig ram
Krenms	huge in my book :)
DELL-ScottH	you can create a group and then assign owners that can access the resources through a web "self service" portal .. and create and manage the Vms themselfs
DELL-ScottH	I thinks that's huge in anyones book !
Krenms	vmserver is a little sluggish compared to what I thought it would be
DELL-ScottH	kind of like the Vmware lab manager product, if you're familiar with that
DELL-ScottH	sluggish ? ... what measurements ?
Krenms	just the feel of our group using it and imaging machines on it
Krenms	no real mesurments
DELL-ScottH	so the hyper-v "feels" faster ?
DELL-ScottH	same hardware ?
Krenms	haven't tried Hyper-v since we got our new Nas
DELL-ToddM	I haven't measured Vmware Server 2.0 either, but to me Vmware Server 1.5 seems better than 2.0
DELL-ToddM	I think becusae Vmware Server 2.0 is still beta - there are some things that aren't quite polished
Krenms	Yea, we have another box similar to the "big box" that is running Vmware Server 1.6 and that performs much better than 2.0
Krenms	Vmware Server 2.0 is Rc now I believe
DELL-ScottH	it's strange that every beta I've worked with .. be it hardware or software .. seems to leave performance tweaking until the end
Krenms	I can understand that
DELL-ScottH	I guess it makes sense to get all the bugs out first
DELL-ScottH	"Man my car has 600 Hp" ..... "yeah, but it's got no wheels !"
DELL-ScottH	::laugh
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DELL-ScottH	hello laine
DELL-ToddM	Laine - Good to see you
Laine_Tsujii	Hi Scott
DELL-ScottH	use "action" .."recent room history" to catch up
DELL-ScottH	Krenms, what was it that irked you in your first use of Scvmm 08 beta ?
Krenms	I only have one piece of hardware.......and I tried install Scvmm on the same box as hyper-v........
Krenms	plus I dind't have the Nas hooked up yet, I was just messing around with it and couldn't get any vm's too boot......it was probably my error, but we have used Vmware server before, so we switched to that and tried that out.
Krenms	been using that for the past month now.........and now I'm a little dissapointed with vmware permisions and performance
DELL-ToddM	If you are just going to have a single server - you might not need Scvmm. Maybe you could get by with just the Hyper-v Manager
DELL-ScottH	so just curious .. why not Esx ?
DELL-ScottH	yeah, scvmm probbably overkill
Krenms	We have Esx in our production.........not for out test $$$$$
Krenms	not for our test
DELL-ScottH	thought I would see those $$$$$ :-)
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Krenms	Yep :)
DELL-ScottH	hello sean !
DELL-ScottH	use "action" ,.... "recent room history" to catch up
Krenms	so I dont install scvmm, then how to I get clients to run their vms?
Sean	hi folks. so whats the general feeling on hyper-v so far?
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DELL-ToddM	I thought that you could install the Hyper-v manager on non-hyper-v server as management stations - but not sure
DELL-ScottH	hello dilip ... use "action" ... "recent room history" to catch up
DELL-ToddM	It won't give you the permissions that you you will need
rayg	Doesn't win2k8 with Hyper v have a built in management tool?
DELL-ToddM	The self service portal with Scvmm sounds perfect for what you need
DELL-ToddM	Yes the win2k8 with hyper-v server has a management tool called Hyper-v Manager
DELL-ScottH	there is an Rdp like client to connect to the Hyper-v vm's ,, is that what you mean by "get clients to run their Vms? "
Krenms	yes, that is what I mean
rayg	i think he said he couldn't get them to boot?
DELL-ScottH	it's called "virtual Machine Connection"
Krenms	That was the first problem......but I'm pretty sure I just got pissed too soon and didn't read all the directions :)
Krenms	Question.....would it be possible for me to run Hyper-v and Vmware Server 2.0 at the same time on the same server to test them both out? I'm probably dreaming.
DELL-ScottH	who wants to Rtfm ? ... not me !
DELL-ScottH	hmmmm...
DELL-ScottH	why don't you try and tell us what happens ?
DELL-ScottH	Todd, let's do a thought exercise ... what do you think would happen ?
DELL-ScottH	I think driver issues ... maybe ... have to test it
DELL-ScottH	todd ?
DELL-ToddM	What are we testing? Clearly I have failed the thought exercise
DELL-ScottH	lol
DELL-ToddM	Need more caffinee
DELL-ScottH	yeah I need some Dew quick
DELL-ScottH	too much tweeting
DELL-ToddM	Hyper-v and Vmware Server 2.0 on same server!
DELL-ToddM	Ok
DELL-ToddM	I haven't triied that , but I did try to run Microsoft Virtual Server 2005 and Hyper-v on the same server
DELL-ToddM	It caused the Rdp connection to the server to drop due to an encrption error about every 30 seconds
DELL-ToddM	Very strange
DELL-ToddM	Along the same lines - we have a wiki page that tells you how you can run Esx under Vmware workstation
Krenms	Would putting Hyper-v on one Nic and Vmware Server 2.0 on a differant Nic help at all?
DELL-ToddM	http://www.delltechcenter.com/page/vmware+virtual+infrastructure+test+environment
DELL-ToddM	Contributed by one of our Dell servidces guys in Europe
DELL-ScottH	so it might work .. unless some hard coding of "if exist Vmware then format c:\"
DELL-ToddM	He uses it as a demo env that he can take with him on his laptop
DELL-ToddM	I would give it a fair chance of working
DELL-ToddM	Although I'm not sure I would recommend it for more than a test :-)
Krenms	True
DELL-ScottH	if you do it, please let us know your findings .... you can simply start a thread on any of the pages on the site and we'll find it
DELL-ScottH	we usually learn as much from you guys as you do from us ... we appreciate that
Krenms	Will do........if I get permesion my my managers first.
DELL-ScottH	hear you on that one
DELL-ScottH	any other questions ? we are rounding the hour ... some final links ...
Laine_Tsujii	thanks for letting me sit in--gotta run to another meeting now.
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DELL-ScottH	here's the landing page to follow -- http://www.delltechcenter.com/page/hyper-v+management
DELL-ScottH	and screenshots -- http://www.delltechcenter.com/page/scvmm+-+system+center+virtual+machine+manager
DELL-ScottH	next weeks chat will be on Scvmm again , then the following we'll discuss Openmanage on Hyper-v
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DELL-ScottH	look for a demo on Scvmm with Vmware Vmotion ..... and one on the self service portal coming soon
DELL-ScottH	thanks again everyone !
Krenms	Thank you
DELL-ScottH	good luck on the testing
DELL-ScottH	let us know if you need help
Krenms	Hopefully this week I'll start
DELL-ScottH	ray thanks for joining .... good luck on yours as well
rayg	my server is on order from you guys so I'll be in too!
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DELL-ScottH	ahhh fresh cardboard smell .. like christmas ... Todd loves it when we get new boxes in the lab
DELL-ScottH	thanks to everyone ..... see you next week !
Krenms	Later
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Stuart	Hi Guys, I am here so it must be time for you guys to go ! :)
DELL-ScottH	hey stuart !
DELL-ScottH	yeah getting close
Stuart	I am working on converting that drac script to vbs.... slow going but at least i am learning stuff :)
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DELL-ScottH	ahhhh , that was on my list to find something that might be able to run .sh scripts in windows ... maybe cygwin ?
DELL-ScottH	greg , you there ?
DELL-ScottH	Greg is Ms Mvp ... and probably good with Vbs
Stuart	I had a chat with some people of some programming forums, they all said that there is no tool which could covert it and so it needs to be re-written. I should have this down today or tomorrow with any luck : )
Stuart	done....
DELL-ScottH	Wow .. done as we speak ?
Stuart	hehehehe no... I was fixing a typo.... down = done.... :)
DELL-ScottH	so how much are we going to have to paypal you to get the code ?
DELL-ScottH	ohh no, you woke todd up
DELL-ToddM	I'm done - down and out, over and out - whatever
Stuart	Do you happen to have a spare shirt??? the guy who posted the .sh should get one if there is a spare one :)
DELL-ToddM	Need to go home and not look at a screen for a few hours
Stuart	Nah, I will post the code as soon as it is tested ect..
DELL-ScottH	ahh yes, some shirt loving
DELL-ScottH	make sure to give him some compliment medals
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DELL-ScottH	I'll work on the shirt
Stuart	okies.... I guess you are off too... seeya next time :)
Stuart	I think i use too many smileys....
DELL-ScottH	hey we're twittering now ... follow us !
DELL-ScottH	www.twitter.com/delltechcenter
Stuart	I have no idea what that is.... but I am on my way... hehehe
DELL-ScottH	yeah, I was total noob on it few weeks ago
DELL-ScottH	this youtube is good intro to it -- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ddo9idmax0o
Stuart	okies thanks... I will try to have a look this morning.... I gotta go due to work.... seeya later !!
Stuart	seeya!